I recently came across what I think is likely an early saw. The name is barely on the spine and was amid enough rust that I had to do a fair bit of scraping to make out what it is. I believe the name is WM Smith & Co and is accompanied by the German Steel mark. Is this a maker that is known to anyone? Below are some photos. Many thanks! Joe
Hi Joe, There are only two W Smiths in HSMOB, none with "& Co." after them and I suspect that neither is your William (I am assuming William as opposed to W.M.) Smith as one is from 1718 to 1750 and the other is 1879. Now I wouldn't know a 1718 to 1750 saw if it jumped up and bit me, but your mark I would put in the first three decades of the 19th C. I hope that someone has a better idea as I don't fancy having to search the Directories for a W. Smith who may or may not be listed under sawmakers and may or may not be in Sheffield. Fred
Hi Fred, Thank you for your reply. I realize I neglected to mention the length of the saw in case that helps. The saw plate is just over 16 and 1/8 inches in length -- which to me seems a rather unusual length. That is longer than any of my backsaws other than those I have for mitre box use. Thanks again, Joe
Smith, William & Edward (, iron masters and steel rollers). Residing at Wicker, Sheffield in 1825. Recorded in: Gells 1825 Directory of Sheffield. Smith, William (, Merchants, Factors and Manufacturers). Residing at 22 Wicker, in 1828-9. Recorded in: Pigot's Commercial Directory - 1828 to 1829. Smith, William Adam (, steel roller &c.). Residing at h. Lower Crabtree, in 1833. Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833. Smith, William & Edward (, iron masters and rollers and slittlers of steel &c.). Residing at 40 Wicker, in 1837. Recorded in: Whites Directory of Sheffield & Rotherham - 1837. Smith, William & Edward (, rollers & slitters of steel). Residing at 37 Wicker, in 1833. Recorded in: Whites History & Directory of Sheffield - 1833. Smith, Wm & Edward (~, Iron Masters, Rollers & Slitters Of Steel). Residing at Wicker Rolling Mills, 86 Wicker, in 1841. Recorded in: Henry & Thos. Rodgers Sheff & Roth Directory - 1841. There's a lot of William Smiths! There are others that are "manufacturers" and "file makers" and "scissors manufacturers"...... take a look at these Fred.
Hi Joe and Toby, To be honest Joe, the odd size of the back does not help me in this instance although it may help others. I think this mark is a case of someone having seen it before and knowing who it is (Simon where are you?) or going round in ever decreasing circles trying to guess. As I implied Toby, a gargantuan task and rather you than me. All you have to do now is to look up said WM Smith in the London and Birmingham directories as well. And that is before the lesser known locations such as Newcastle upon Tyne are searched. Given a choice of your list of Smiths so far I would have to go with the merchant and manufacturer. But I am not so sure that it is him. I was wondering if it was a forerunner of "Wheatman and" But again a complete and unadulterated WAG. Fred On looking at the mark afresh, I am now going for 1815 to 1835. I cannot give a valid reason, it just "looks" like those dates.
Position of Stamp I dont know if this has any bearing, but I was wondering if the position of the stamp means anything. Ive noticed that many of the earlier saw have the stamp at the base of the back closer to the blade. Is this just me? I get the impression that as time went on the makers mark became of more significance morphing from a lowly stamp to full on descriptive stamp, trade marks and all centre stage of the back often accompanied by wonderful etchings (like lorenzos saw which is a beauty). Just a thought.
It was the style of mark and placement that led me to the dates WAGged. As you say, low on the back like that to me implies pre mid 1830's (experience with my own saws, but not sufficiently certain to say it definitively). But no reclining ampersand. But then again, I had never knowingly seen one before re-reading Simon's post. Fred
Reclining ampersand Hi Fred, Check out the Pickslay on an early post. Definitely reclining or at least relaxed. Cheers Al