Wm. Hargreaves & Co.

Being new to this group, I thought I'd say hello and show one of the saws that lead me here.

I've been collecting saws (tools in general, actually) for quite awhile. I enjoy the knowledge that I get by digging into their history and learning how to use them. I have always been enamored with backsaws, and I find them to be the most elegant of tools.

One that I have acquired is a 15" saw badged Wm. Hargreaves & Co. Sheffield.

What I have found out about this saw maker has mostly come from Catalogs of the London and New York Exhibitions of 1853. Hargreaves was listed as displaying examples of very elaborate Cutlery and razors as well as "saws of best cast steel". I have also found that Straight Razors made by the same manufacturer appear to be quite appreciated by enthusiasts, and there are several exquisite examples of them on the net. While some were shown to be made by "Hargreaves & Co." others were made under the name "Hargreavs, Smith and co" or "W&L Hargreaves and co". The manufacturer "Hargreavs, Smith and co" was listed at 28 Eyre Lane, Sheffield from 1866 to 1920(Goins Encyclopedia of Cutlery Markings).

In the "Birmingham & District and Sheffield & Rotherham Commercial list of 1876" the company "Hargreavs, Smith and co" was listed in the "dissolutions of partnership sections" where it looks like the company changed hands several times between 1862 and 1876 .

The saw seems to be very similar to some made by W. R. Groves with the handle being an almost exact match for the one in saws4me's galleryhttp://www.backsaw.net/cpg/thumbnails.php?album=53. Even the crown in the stamp on the back seems to match the one on the Groves saw. Is there a chance that both could have been made by the same company? Would there have been one company in Sheffield that supplied handles to more than one saw maker?









Well, Thanks for the great resource! I look forward to see where it leads!

mut

 

Take all this with a pinch of salt, but here goes.

If you can plough your way through an early effort by me on Saw Identification by Handle in "Saw pictures and Measurements, I think that one of the conclusions reached was that handles were made for different manufacturers by the same maker, and so presumably they may have supplied the same handle to different makers.

The genealogy of William Hargreaves as a company below duplicates some of what you have done but also, I think, adds some as well.

Starting with HSMOB. They have Hargreaves,Smith and Co. 1884 to1891.

They are also recorded in Whites (Sheffield and Rotherham) in 1879.

In Whites of 1862, they have Hargreaves Smith and Co. at 28 Eyre Lane, but they also have Hargreaves, William linked to Hargreaves Smith and Co. (Page 103)

In Whites 1852 they have Hargreaves, William and Lydin as merchants and tableknife manufacturers at 28 Eyre Lane and Hargreave, William as living at Broomhill Park and recorded as a merchant and manufacturer. (Page 124)

In Whites 1849 Hargreaves, William and Lydin are recorded at 28 Eyre Lane and William lives at Hanover Square.

The direct link gets broken here, but Whites of 1833 has a Colley and Hargreaves, table knife manufacturers and merchants at 100 Eyre Lane and William Hargreaves, merchant at Brook Hill.

Colley and Hargreaves are in Gell 1828.

They are also in Baines 1822 at 53 Burgess St. (p. 311), and Hargreaves William, table knife manufactures at Brookhill. (p. 321)

And that is as far back as I can go.

Now, it may well be that there is a different William Hargeaves entirely, but I hope not, but what is possible is that there are William Hargreaves', father and son

And as one last thing, to end with a query and with something that may invalidate all the information above, Hargreaves,Smith and Co. are in Trademarks on Base Metal, but not with the trade mark on your saw's medallion. (It is on page 97. I can't copy and paste from Trademarks, but I know that Ray can if he would do it.)

Does this imply a different company altogether or the new company merely creating a new tade mark?

Fred

 

Thanks for the help and the great info! Fred, I tired to find your piece on Saw handle identification, but have not had luck ( sorry I'm still trying to find my way around this site).

Ray, I took a second look at the back and the stamp Reads "H" over "Best".

I checked to see if any of the cutlery or razors on the net might have a trade mark visible on them, but didn't see any.

mut