Thomas Turner and C. Nurse

Hey Guys,
Great stuff! I've only been serious about hand saws for about a year-and-a-half, but it doesn't take long to see that a great deal of the interest lies in that which is also fascinating to archaeologists and historians: going over pottery shards and bones with a fine brush, searching through old records and creating type studies and timelines and finally perhaps gaining a bit of a wider view of the situation as it once might have existed. It is a pleasure to post a little bit of information and see people with more experience and expertise create a discussion. I suppose a great deal of this is knowing where to look; I have a rather myopic view at this time, so I have no idea to what extent company records still exist, how well documented the relationships between different companies are and what is left to conjecture.
I gather that there is no complete list of companies that provided saws for Charles Nurse. Until I saw this thread, I didn't even know that Nurse didn't produce them. In the reference to cutlery manufacturers the two arm and hammer marks are exactly the same as stated, do you think this is because they would have been the same in actual practice, or because the person compiling the graphics used the same artwork? Why would two different companies have similar logos? Of course, the Hephaestian reference would be hard to resist for any company that worked in metal.
I apologize for the newbie questions, I will get my hands on some of the Sheffield reference books when I can, I'm just still at the stage where I'm trying to get a sense of the scope of all of this.
Also, if you are interested, I have posted two pictures of the entire saw in the galleries section. I don't know if the handle tells us anything, it seems to be beech and is in a traditional British style.
Thanks, Bart

 

You could say;

"The artistry of the saw is free and clear for all to see,
But there's mystery in its history of where and when it came to be."


aparently Alfred Beckett & Sons took over Wheatman and Smith c1915, so the arm and hammer trade mark would have moved with the change in ownership
see http://www.backsaw.net/index.php?option=com_jfusion&Itemid=58&jfile=showthread.php&t=232

 

Hi Kiwi,

I have looked at the full saw on the "galleries" section and I don't think that it is a Beckett and Sons era saw.

It is not impossible but the style of the handle and the flat saw screws and medallion would put it, I believe in my 1860's (previously 70's)+ bracket.

They could have kept the flat screws going up to and beyond 1915 but I think that it is generally not the case.

Does anyone have a catalogue to provide a definitive answer?

Fred

 

I agree Fred,

Bart's saw looks pre 1900 with the split-nuts and london flat handle, although HSMOB lists C Nurse & Co as 1905-1937 ?

"Trademarks for..." states it's trademark listing is for "late 18th century to c 1900", which predates the reported c1915 Wheatman/Beckett takeover (no references provided for source documents for either of these "facts")

I've never seen a Beckett saw with the arm & hammar trademark (but I'd not seen it on a Wheatman either, before your post, so that's not much help)

Conflicting "facts" on saw history keeps things interesting doesn't it ?

 

I have a small Buck and Ryan handsaw with the exact same engraving.

 

Sorry my memory failed me.

After a bit more cleaning the engraving on my saw in a very similar style says " For quality and workmanship, this saw cannot be excelled. Geo H. Buck"

 

This is the Buck and Ryan saw.