Moseley & Sons

Discussion in 'Forum: Saw Identification and Discussion' started by kiwi, Aug 27, 2011.

  1. kiwi

    kiwi Most Valued Member

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    352
    This 14" saw has a heavy brass back, stamped "Moseley & Sons, London " (along with "GW" and "J Leach" which I assume are owner's stamps)
    What's interesting about the stamp is that it has " & Sons" (plural), whereas the listings I've found all have "& Son" (singular)
    Did John Moseley have more than one son working for him at some time ? (either a later addition to the business, or a son that left or got excommunicated following a family tiff ?)
    HSMOB has John Moseley & Son as 1849-72, although that listing still seems to be retained in an 1882 directory.

    Anyone else with a Moseley & Sons ?
     

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  2. ray

    ray Administrator Staff Member

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    668
    Hi Kiwi,

    Nice saw, I'm not able to shed any light on Moseley and Sons.

    But what strikes me about this saw is the placement of the screws.. both high up and towards to front of the cheek..

    Now I need to go and l find some other London makers of that era, to see if it's a typical feature.

    Very stylish looking handle too.

    Regards
    Ray
     
  3. PeterEvans

    PeterEvans Most Valued Member

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    49
    Ray, there are 3 screws.

    Cheers
    Peter
     
  4. ray

    ray Administrator Staff Member

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    668
    Hi Peter,

    Thanks, now I can see the third one... :)

    Regards
    Ray
     
  5. Deesinister

    Deesinister Most Valued Member

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    Goodmans

    Hi Kiwi,
    Goodmans British plane makers has "Mosely and son" become "& Sons" between 1831 and 1837, however it reverts to Mosely and Son after.


    The Sun insurances indicate that John Mosely died in 1828 and the business was taken over by his son William in that year.
     
  6. ray

    ray Administrator Staff Member

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    668
    Hi Deesinister,

    You must have the 3rd edition of Goodman, I can't find Moseley and Sons in my 2nd edition.. (but then again, I have trouble seeing saw screws... :) )

    Can you check if there is any reference to Moseley and Sons making saws in your edition of Goodman?

    The look and style of the stamp and the sharpness of the chamfer on the back of the saw, look (to my inexperienced eye) more like 1870's than 1830's, but I'd like to hear another opinion on that.

    I did find a Moseley and Sons (planemakers) in the catalog of the 1851 exhibition. But, not sawmakers..

    Nothing like a good mystery saw, especially one as nice as this.

    Regards
    Ray
     
  7. Deesinister

    Deesinister Most Valued Member

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    58
    goodmans

    Hi kiwi,
    I can't find any reference to saw making in Goodmans, however it states that the firm split into two identities 1862 forming a retail and a wholesale branch.
    I think its unlikely that the retail arm would have just sold planes and not any other tools, so you may find that the stamp is a dealers stamp and not a makers mark. Conjecture I know.
     
  8. shoarthing

    shoarthing Most Valued Member

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    Kiwi - Hi - I have a 14” heavy brass-back “MOSELEY&SONS” sash saw on its way to me which appears very similar to yours . . . but with just the two saw-screws.

    As Deesinister wrote a decade ago; the date-range of that stamp appears likely to be 1831-37 . . . same info. in Jane Rees’ 4th Edition of Goodman’s.

    As you know, there’s a “MOSELEY&SONS” wholesale price-list for their saws, tucked into a commonplace book of I K Brunel, now in Bristol University’s Brunel archive. This commonplace book’s contents date between 1829-44. Wholesale price for the 14” brass-back was 90s per doz. . . . . retail price per item might realistically be up to near double that, ie 15s . . . quite a sum in the reign of William IV

    . . . . worth noting this price list describes the company as “Saw Manufacturers”

    NB would you mind examining the topmost saw-screw of your saw to see if its gross & stem diameters appear identical to the lower two screws, please?
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2021
  9. kiwi

    kiwi Most Valued Member

    Messages:
    352
    Shoarthing. Thanks for the info. Goodman/Rees may be correct for 1830s, although Barley dates my mark at mid 1800s. Regarding prices; as my saw is used, I might be able to let it go for only half original retail price, say 7 or 8 shillings (in William IV silver shillings of course :) )
    All the screws on my saw are the same size, approx 1/8" shafts with heads a smidgen under 1/2" diameter. (I assume your saw has a different sized top screw, a nice decorative feature more commonly found on larger hand/rip saws, and you'll post pictures when you receive it)