Groves and Sons 28" Rip saw

Discussion in 'Forum: Saw Identification and Discussion' started by rob1713, Jan 3, 2018.

  1. rob1713

    rob1713 Member

    Messages:
    24
    I picked up a few saws earlier this week. Upon cleaning them, I was very pleased to find one is a Groves and sons. It has come up very nicely with only a light clean with autosol on the plate and 0000 grade wire wool on the handle.
    It has a stamp that is a bit different from those in BS&SM and it has a star clearly stamped on it which I can find no parallel for. The style of lettering has similarities to the 1830's and 1840's stamps in the book so I'm dating it between those time brackets.
    The plate is straight with all its teeth and is nice and tight in the handle. It's Graduated from 4 TPI to 3 TPI and cuts very nicely now I've sharpened it, so I may keep it as a user for any big ripping jobs that come up
    I'd be pleased to hear your views on my guessed date or the significance of the star.
     

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  2. Joe S

    Joe S Most Valued Member

    Messages:
    316
    Hey Rob et al
    Wonderful saw and what a beast. There seems to be different things that are so nice and and yet might suggest an earlier and yet later time frame than you are suggesting. Suggesting that early date date might be that heavily rounded nose. That very unusual star is something I have never witnessed on a British saw but only on early 1840/1850 American saws from the New York Sing Sing area. I would love to be corrected if there are British examples but I can't come up with any so far. See something new every day. I don't know where you are located Rob , but was wondering if the saw was found outside of Britain and therefore a saw made for export? Groves were know for the USE trident trademark after the 1840s and yet it seems it isn't present or that you have discovered on this saw. Simon does mention that the use of capital then lower case in other words was a post 1840 phenomena. The Cast Steel doesn't shed much light since it seems to be missing a little clarity to suggest there might have been something between the two words. The shape of the handle is so vertical and the presence of a blank in the medallion location I find seems to be more of an post 1840 thing also. I would probably push the dating of the saw back to 1840/50 but no less a terrific example of an exciting and rare example. Well done and enjoy putting it through it's paces.
    thanks for sharing.
    Joe S.
     
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  3. rob1713

    rob1713 Member

    Messages:
    24
    Thanks for your comments Joe, I still can't be sure of whether there is a dot between cast and steel, it's quite worn in that area but there is a mark that could be a result of pitting or it could be a dot, (I keep changing my mind every time I look at it under a glass.) I bought the saw in the UK so it is less likely to have been made for export.
    The saw nuts look to be untouched, but the blank medallion is a little small for its hole and looks to have been packed out with some kind of filler. This does look original and the file marks on the nuts are all in line but I've never seen this before.