George Carr Tenon Backsaw

Discussion in 'Forum: Saw Identification and Discussion' started by PhillipR, Nov 1, 2015.

  1. PhillipR

    PhillipR New Member

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    3
    I picked up a saw recently at an estate sale and needed some help in identification of a George Carr back saw. About all I can find is he was a British saw maker around 1820-1840. Any information would be appreciated. It has a 14" x4" blade, chipped horn, cracked lambs tongue, worm hole in grip with partial repair, spine marked George Carr looks relatively straight. Blade marked GEO CAR, pitted one one side, teeth worn out, slight curve.
    image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg Is it rare? What is its value? Is it worth restoration? Who could I send it to if it's worth repairing? I probably wouldn't use it again but would like to add it to my tool collection.
     

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  2. Joe S

    Joe S Most Valued Member

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    376
    Nice Saw Phillip
    If you are interested in saws and planning on getting more like this I might suggest Simon's book
    There were a few George Carr but I think this would be the early incantation. Simon has him from 1787- 1841. No stamps pictured but at some point he had his son and a Co. I am going to suggest you would be looking at an 1790-1810 saw.
    It has seen a lot of years and been well loved.
    Enjoy this one
    Joe S.
     
  3. fred0325

    fred0325 Most Valued Member

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    1,084
    Hi Phillip,

    This is a bit of an enigma. I think that I agree with Joe that you are looking at the 1787 onwards George Carr.

    The handle resembles two examples that Simon has in his book on P 92 and which are dated 1820, but this is by no means a certain dating.

    What is fascinating is that the saw is stamped with the maker's name on both the back and the blade. This is something that I haven't come across before and may indicate a saw earlier than the earliest date mentioned here. But don't get too excited about that as my experience in the esoteric field of early saws is very limited and counts for little. But if I may just add a "wing and a prayer" WAG here, this may be a transition from stamping the blade to stamping the back. A bit like archeopteryx supposedly being the transition between dinosaur and bird.

    Is it rare? Yes. If it is early then it is probably unique

    Is it valuable? For a saw like this (again, if it is early) it is probably near the top end of the value curve for a battered British saw. I would certainly give various bits of my anatomy for it. I might also give money.:)

    Is it worth repairing. Definitely not. If it is old, then leave it exactly as it is. For the saw collecting purists out there, doing anything to this saw (apart from being a heresy) would detract from its desirability.

    Just one question for those who might know, could this be the Carr of Kenyon Hutton and Carr. BSSM has them both at Isle in the 1770's.

    Hoping that it is an early one but still not getting too excited yet.

    Fred
     
  4. ray

    ray Administrator Staff Member

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    671
    Hi Phillip,

    Thanks for posting the pictures,

    Following up on what Fred has already noted, the stamp on the blade, is something not seen in later saws, I think the only ones I'm aware of are some early Birmingham makers who stamped the blade... So, is this the first Sheffield maker to be found with the blade stamped, or are there others?

    It get more interesting by the minute...

    Ray

    PS... It goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway... don't attempt any restoration! leave it as is.
     
  5. PhillipR

    PhillipR New Member

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    Thanks, so much for the information. I usually only find the run of the mill saws like Atkins, Bishop or Disston. I never thought for a moment this was a British saw or that it was as old as it is. It wasn't until I stumbled upon this website that I found any information pertaining to the maker.
     
  6. Barleys

    Barleys Most Valued Member

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    546
    Reach for the green-with-envy icon! As Ray says, this is a seriously early and so far unique Sheffield saw, and I wouldn't have much hesitation in ascribing to George Carr, in his days next to the Kenyons on the Isle, or maybe a little later, after he crossed the river to Bridgehouses and his subsequent addresses close by. Can Phillip give us any idea of its past history? Where you found it? Unlikely, alas, as these things seem to pop up (why does it always seem to be in America?) in a box of rubbish for a lucky Phillip to pick up.
    Phillip: may I ask for some large image pictures of this saw for my database? Preferably one direct of the whole saw, similar to your first, then a close up of each of the marks? My email address is barleys@mac.com.
    We are all really very much in your debt for sharing this with us.
     
  7. PhillipR

    PhillipR New Member

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    3
    Barleys, Thank you for your interest and information on the saw. Picked it up at an estate sale in Jacksonville Florida. I have no information on the previous owner. (Deceased) I'll send you an email with additional pictures the first chance I get.