Drabble and Sanderson

Discussion in 'Forum: Saw Identification and Discussion' started by lui, Oct 30, 2010.

  1. lui

    lui Most Valued Member

    Messages:
    77
    Hello everyone,

    I'm new here, I'm a green oak timber framer from the UK, as a result of the carpentry that I do I have more of an interest in the larger hand saws than the backed saws, but please don't hold that against me.

    Here are some pics of a Drabble and Sanderson 28" rip saw, 4ppi at the heal changing to 4-1/2ppi at the toe. The stamped makers mark has London attached but I suspect that this is a quality rather than location.

    Any further info would be greatly appreciated.

    All my saws are rehabilitated for use, this saw still needs jointing and resharpening.

    Thanks for looking,

    regards

    lui

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  2. ray

    ray Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    671
    Hi Lui,

    Those big rip saws would take more muscle power than I could muster to push... maybe in my younger years!... :)

    Drabble and Sanderson were a well known Sheffield based sawmaker, so you are correct in noting the "London" mark is a quality or pattern indicator rather than location.

    They were making saws in Sheffield from the 1820's through to at least the early 1900's when they were bought out by Spear and Jackson in 1907.

    Your saw appears to be stamped rather than etched, that sometimes indicates a date prior to 1850, most sawmakers changed to etching after 1849 because of the manufacturing advantage. So it seems likely that a large maker like Drabble and Sanderson would have been quick to adopt the etching process.
    Simon might have more information on when Drabble and Sanderson started buying transfers from Bagshaws.

    Some of their backsaws, have a crown over the arched Drabble and Sanderson, I can't see any crown on your mark, have a close look and see if you can see something like this..
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    If yours doesn't have the crown, then it might be possible to find out when they changed the mark.

    My best guess is it's pre 1850. so a working range of 1825-1850.

    Here's a different question, has anyone ever seen a Drabble & Sanderson Medallion? I can't recall ever seeing one... maybe they didn't use them?

    Again, it's in great condition for a saw that's probably 160+ years old. Nice find.

    Regards
    Ray
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2010
  3. lui

    lui Most Valued Member

    Messages:
    77
    Hi Ray,

    Thanks again for your information.

    The stamp does not have a crown over the top.

    I have also seen a D&S on ebay without a crown, it was a 24" Xcut, and the mark was definatly stamped in on that one. It was a really nice saw but I wasn't going to pay £85 for it. Mine was £8 from an antiques shop.

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    The ebay one was interesting as the stamp was the same as mine (LONDON) but also had the "warranted" and "caststeel" either side of the curved D&S. as in your example.

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    What conclusions could be made from this? assuming they were all made in sheffield.

    The LONDON mark on it's own is probably earliest. Quality or pattern?

    The cast steel and LONDON mark followed, this implies that the LONDON was a pattern style since the cast steel implies quallity.

    The added crown and Sheffield, follows on when sheffield was recognised as a centre for fabricating. Or it might be a differnt style saw.

    As for the medallion the Xcut saw doesn't have one either.

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    regards

    lui
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2010
  4. fred0325

    fred0325 Most Valued Member

    Messages:
    1,084
    Hello all, (and especially Ray),

    Things are getting ( and I normally hold no truck with this concept) spooky. About the time that Ray was referring to German Steel, I was buying a saw with German Steel on it, and now Ray asks about a Drabble and Sanderson medallion, and lo and behold, I bought a saw with one on a couple of weeks ago. (I only took delivery about three days ago).

    Luckily, the lady who sold it on ebay along with 2 others, only showed the split nuts at the back (not the medallion), and one of those is missing and so it attracted no interest except for my bid.

    I have put the pictures of the saw in my gallery, as they do not add much to the sum of human knowledge, but the medallion I attach below. The saw is brass backed, 16 inches from the toe to the tip of the bottom horn, the blade is 12 inches and there would have been at one time about 12 points per inch. The right hand nut above the medallion also looks wrong to me, in addition to it having no split nut on the reverse.

    Hope this helps,
    Fred
     

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  5. ray

    ray Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    671
    Hi Fred,

    Thanks for the Drabble and Sanderson Medallion, I think it's the first one I've seen.

    What about a picture of the rest of the saw?

    Edit: Ok I Found it.
    [​IMG]

    Incidentally, I neglected to mention my complete lack of any psychic ability, maybe, you have some psychic ability where saws are concerned.. :)


    Regards
    Ray
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2010
  6. Joe S

    Joe S Most Valued Member

    Messages:
    376
    Hey Ray et al
    Nice Saw Lui. I probably don't have a lot to add to this thread but I did look through the examples I have from this maker. These were all Sheffield made and the first example looks quite similar to yours. I had never seen a medallion and Fred's example is a first for me also. Very cool.
    The medallion spot was usually filled with a larger split nut or one of comparible size to the others. My first example is of a 28" rip behemoth. No crowns in the stamp. What I did find unusual and I hadn't noticed or paid attention to one before is the 3/8 stamp to measure TPI at the heal corner. This 3/8 actually measures a single tooth every 3/8ths of an inch. Large teeth.
    The second saw is a Sheffield saw with a "London Pattern" handle.
    enjoy the pics
    Joe S
     

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