Boynton Lightning Saw

Discussion in 'Forum: Saw Identification and Discussion' started by David, Nov 20, 2014.

  1. David

    David Most Valued Member

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    Most of the saws that show up here are English. Here's an unusual American backsaw made by Eben Moody Boynton, who was an inventor, politician and manufacturer in the second half of the 19th century. Wiktor's website "Traditional Woodworking Tools Internet Magazine" has an in-depth discussion of this archetypal American go-getter and his life and inventions. Don't miss the discussion of his "Bicycle Locomotive".

    His "Lightning Saw" made use of a tooth pattern that permitted very fast and efficient cutting, first developed for one and two-man crosscut saws, upon which he made his reputation. I've never seen a backsaw before with this sort of tooth pattern, and wonder if it was really worthwhile on a backsaw. Nonetheless, the existence of this saw demonstrates that Eben thought it made sense. However, I think that the rarity of this saw demonstrates the opinions his clientele may have had of this tooth pattern's usefulness on this sort of saw

    David boynton lightning backsaw.jpg Boynton etch.jpg boyntonad.jpg
     
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  2. summerfi

    summerfi Most Valued Member

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    Hi David,
    Very interesting saw! Looks like it would cut on both the push and pull strokes, but might be hard to start the cut . As for the ad that states they cut a cord of wood in 9 minutes, now that is impressive even for a modern chainsaw.
    Bob
     
  3. David

    David Most Valued Member

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    315
    Hi Bob,
    Yes, cutting on both the push and the pull was the idea behind the M-pattern filing. Although Boynton claimed it as his own invention, a later lawsuit discovered that it went back to the Dutch in the centuries before. I agree that it looks hard to start. This saw is too dull to cut with and I'm not the person to sharpen it as intended. And the ad says it cut sixteen pieces "at the rate of a cord in less than nine minutes." I imagine the sawyers would get tired before they managed to actually produce a cord of firewood. It might take them a bit longer.
    David
     
  4. wiktor48

    wiktor48 Most Valued Member

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    97
    Hi all,
    This is an interesting saw. I also never seen something like this. Boynton was definitely on a maniacal side of life, so I am not surprised that tried to sell this kind of saw. However, he was definitely one of these very interesting men of 19th Century that pushed an envelope. Another one was James E. Emerson, who was a co-funder of American Saw Company. One day I will organize all the thoughts around this kind of personalities in our industrial history and try to write it up.

    David, I am not familiar with a lawsuit that pointed this design of the saw tooth to Dutch. Any leads?

    BTW, the handle is nice and looks like very well preserved.
     
  5. David

    David Most Valued Member

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    315
    Hi Wiktor,
    Thanks for your question, which made me search out my reference. Only to discover, I'm embarrassed to say, how sloppily I had read it the first time. The quote, on page 2 of your Historical Overview of Boynton actually reads as "Perhaps the most ingenious imitations of the Boynton saws was one patterned after the ancient "M"-tooth of the Netherlands of 1683, which was discovered during the infringement suits." It was the imitation, not the Boynton saw, patterned on the old Dutch model. I apologize for my carelessness.

    Yes, Boynton was one of many interesting 19th century characters with big ideas on many different subjects. I look forward to reading your thoughts about them. I'll try to read them more carefully than I have previously.
    David
     
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  6. wiktor48

    wiktor48 Most Valued Member

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    97
    David, you making me a bit paranoid... that I missed something. Well, not really. I know I missed many things and many things still need to be discovered, understood and presented to all of us. I am always looking for more volunteers, jus in case someone is tempted... ;-)

    Here is a direct link to the Boynton section
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2014
  7. Barleys

    Barleys Most Valued Member

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    546
    Another example of the fierceness of the competition amongst saw makers in the 19th and 20th centuries. In their understated British way, Robert Sorby also could make you a backsaw of what seems today like a peculiar tooth form – this catalogue drops in the mention of fleam teeth on request, and there is one illustratated on p55 of BSSM. The Hawley Collection also has one which seems to be original.
     
  8. Barleys

    Barleys Most Valued Member

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    546
    Forgot to upload the extract from the 1935 catalogue IMG_0480.jpg
     
  9. wiktor48

    wiktor48 Most Valued Member

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    97
    Hi Simon,
    I am curious if Sorby, or any other English sawmaker that offered Fleam Teeth, offered detail explanation what this Fleam Teeth offer provides and what, in their understanding, Fleam Teeth are.
     
  10. Barleys

    Barleys Most Valued Member

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    546
    I've not seen anything, Wiktor. And the two retired (and very experienced) joiners who are my fellow volunteer curators at the Hawley Collection have no idea either! I've not seen any other makers offering this apparently strange choice.
     
  11. fred0325

    fred0325 Most Valued Member

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    1,084
    I don't know whether this helps or hinders, or even whether it is genuine or not.

    But could fleam teeth look anything like this.

    NB This is an image off Ebay and the man makes a living selling them, so I felt obliged to buy one before posting this.

    Apologies for the picture, the double fleams come out quite well on the Ebay version. If it is relevant then I will post a proper image when I get mine, or go to

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/141480283...49&var=440629607775&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

    It looks like he has all sorts of interesting drawings.

    Fred
     

    Attached Files:

  12. wiktor48

    wiktor48 Most Valued Member

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    Hi all,

    Here is the patent Fred referred to. Although this is not strictly a fleam-tooth (also called flem-tooth, flem, and fleam), but it addresses the same issue as fleam edge in the saw tooth. I am also attaching a short excerpt from a book "Practical Carpentry: Being a Complete, Up-to-date Explanation..." by W. A. Radford, 1906. It is available on Google Books. For these who are interested, there are many books explaining what the fleam, (also: flem, fleam-tooth, flem-tooth) is.

    US58297-E. J. Robinson_Page_1-800.jpg US58297-E. J. Robinson_Page_1-02-800.jpg US58297-E. J. Robinson_Page_2-800.jpg flem-tooth-01.jpg